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	<title>Comments on: AutoCAD 2011 online Help changes &#8211; a curate&#8217;s egg</title>
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	<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/</link>
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		<title>By: David Kozina</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4942</link>
		<dc:creator>David Kozina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jun 2010 17:23:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4942</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been trying to use the online 2011 Help a little.
Here are a couple of observations (also posted to Shaan Hurley&#039;s blog).

1- In previous versions of the help documentation, there were three arrow page navigation buttons: &#039;back&#039; &#039;up&#039; and &#039;forward&#039;.  IMO, this was intuitive and allowed me to scan through a subject in a more or less LINEAR manner (without skipping anything important) like perusing a manual.  But these simple navigation buttons are missing.  Why?
In the new system, although there is a &#039;navigation topic box&#039; at upper left of the webpage, the very limited &#039;tree outline&#039; format it displays is basically just irritating to me.
For one thing, the indentation of the subtopics is not pronounced enough (compare with the indentation in the index), so it is difficult to tell what is a main topic and what is a subtopic.
Another consequence is that since the topic/subtopic format *changes* relative to what page is being displayed, the positions of the topics headings on the page also change, so I cannot keep my cursor in the same basic place to click to move forward to the next page (like one could do with &#039;back&#039; &#039;up&#039; &#039;forward&#039; buttons); instead I must figure out each time what topic I&#039;ve seen or am looking at, and where I need to go next.  This just slows me down.  This seems to be a poor webpage design issue to me.

2- Another issue relates to the beautiful ActiveX Object Model found here:
AutoLISP Developer&#039;s Guide &gt; Using the Visual LISP Environment &gt; Working with ActiveX &gt; Understanding the AutoCAD Object Model.

In previous versions of Help, you could actually click on each type of object shown IN the diagram, such as LightweightPolyline, and you would be taken to a page detailing that object&#039;s properties, methods, etc.  I cannot tell you how so VERY useful this flowchart was for me to look up information - but now that linkage to the objects seems to be lost.  Why?  Who broke it?

I would not be surprised to find other deficiencies in this new online format, but these are two major ones I see right away that are really maddening.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been trying to use the online 2011 Help a little.<br />
Here are a couple of observations (also posted to Shaan Hurley&#8217;s blog).</p>
<p>1- In previous versions of the help documentation, there were three arrow page navigation buttons: &#8216;back&#8217; &#8216;up&#8217; and &#8216;forward&#8217;.  IMO, this was intuitive and allowed me to scan through a subject in a more or less LINEAR manner (without skipping anything important) like perusing a manual.  But these simple navigation buttons are missing.  Why?<br />
In the new system, although there is a &#8216;navigation topic box&#8217; at upper left of the webpage, the very limited &#8216;tree outline&#8217; format it displays is basically just irritating to me.<br />
For one thing, the indentation of the subtopics is not pronounced enough (compare with the indentation in the index), so it is difficult to tell what is a main topic and what is a subtopic.<br />
Another consequence is that since the topic/subtopic format *changes* relative to what page is being displayed, the positions of the topics headings on the page also change, so I cannot keep my cursor in the same basic place to click to move forward to the next page (like one could do with &#8216;back&#8217; &#8216;up&#8217; &#8216;forward&#8217; buttons); instead I must figure out each time what topic I&#8217;ve seen or am looking at, and where I need to go next.  This just slows me down.  This seems to be a poor webpage design issue to me.</p>
<p>2- Another issue relates to the beautiful ActiveX Object Model found here:<br />
AutoLISP Developer&#8217;s Guide &gt; Using the Visual LISP Environment &gt; Working with ActiveX &gt; Understanding the AutoCAD Object Model.</p>
<p>In previous versions of Help, you could actually click on each type of object shown IN the diagram, such as LightweightPolyline, and you would be taken to a page detailing that object&#8217;s properties, methods, etc.  I cannot tell you how so VERY useful this flowchart was for me to look up information &#8211; but now that linkage to the objects seems to be lost.  Why?  Who broke it?</p>
<p>I would not be surprised to find other deficiencies in this new online format, but these are two major ones I see right away that are really maddening.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Cowgill</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4736</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Cowgill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 14:11:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4736</guid>
		<description>you are correct, it isn&#039;t insisted on for help, I can have my default browser set for help, I was indeed referring to CERs</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you are correct, it isn&#8217;t insisted on for help, I can have my default browser set for help, I was indeed referring to CERs</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4735</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 12:27:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4735</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s not &lt;em&gt;insisted on&lt;/em&gt;, fortunately. Not here, anyway. Crash and it&#039;s a different matter, as you know. But point taken, the user&#039;s browser choice should be supported and respected, by default, in all places.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not <em>insisted on</em>, fortunately. Not here, anyway. Crash and it&#8217;s a different matter, as you know. But point taken, the user&#8217;s browser choice should be supported and respected, by default, in all places.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Cowgill</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4734</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Cowgill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 11:53:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4734</guid>
		<description>well if their reasoning for switching to html is for mac, then why the insistence on using IE?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>well if their reasoning for switching to html is for mac, then why the insistence on using IE?</p>
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		<title>By: Wm.J.Townsend</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4733</link>
		<dc:creator>Wm.J.Townsend</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 07:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4733</guid>
		<description>One might imagine the reason for this stupid help decision is the huge number seats that they may eventually sell of ACAD for Apples since Macs can&#039;t render CHM files. You&#039;d think that the bonfire sized pile of unsold R12 for Macs might grace a remembrance poster somewhere on campus. So many bad decisions in so little time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One might imagine the reason for this stupid help decision is the huge number seats that they may eventually sell of ACAD for Apples since Macs can&#8217;t render CHM files. You&#8217;d think that the bonfire sized pile of unsold R12 for Macs might grace a remembrance poster somewhere on campus. So many bad decisions in so little time.</p>
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		<title>By: R. Paul Waddington</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4731</link>
		<dc:creator>R. Paul Waddington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 00:52:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4731</guid>
		<description>Steve, it may be instructive for Autodesk to understand peoples tolerance to ‘waiting’ is very short and measured in tenths of a second not seconds. At freeway speed, one second is 30 metres; for a person waiting on an ‘urgent’ response, from a system, one second is perceived as intolerable.

The other measure(s) to be applied to a ‘new’ system, such as this, is to know why it is being attempted and for what reasons?  What are the goals Autodesk has set for this system?  Is it the case change is being made because change ‘is seen as inevitable’ even though it is not required and, as a result the goals for, and, the measure of the success of ‘the change’, is to be work out by users, on the fly, for Autodesk; instead of, Autodesk setting sensible and measurable goals prior to starting the project?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve, it may be instructive for Autodesk to understand peoples tolerance to ‘waiting’ is very short and measured in tenths of a second not seconds. At freeway speed, one second is 30 metres; for a person waiting on an ‘urgent’ response, from a system, one second is perceived as intolerable.</p>
<p>The other measure(s) to be applied to a ‘new’ system, such as this, is to know why it is being attempted and for what reasons?  What are the goals Autodesk has set for this system?  Is it the case change is being made because change ‘is seen as inevitable’ even though it is not required and, as a result the goals for, and, the measure of the success of ‘the change’, is to be work out by users, on the fly, for Autodesk; instead of, Autodesk setting sensible and measurable goals prior to starting the project?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4730</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 15:16:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4730</guid>
		<description>I think it must be a relative of his. Either that or the car key gnomes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it must be a relative of his. Either that or the car key gnomes.</p>
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		<title>By: David Kozina</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4729</link>
		<dc:creator>David Kozina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 14:10:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4729</guid>
		<description>Regarding your comment:
&#039;One of the risks of online-based software is that it can be a moving target. Stuff that you used in the past may not be there the next time you need it.&#039;

Maybe the &#039;drunken evil leprechaun in the toolshed&#039; of Revit GUI fame (put a tool down and who know where it will turn up again) has moved from that neighborhood to &#039;assist&#039; us with ACAD Help?  Or maybe it&#039;s his (also evil) twin brother?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding your comment:<br />
&#8216;One of the risks of online-based software is that it can be a moving target. Stuff that you used in the past may not be there the next time you need it.&#8217;</p>
<p>Maybe the &#8216;drunken evil leprechaun in the toolshed&#8217; of Revit GUI fame (put a tool down and who know where it will turn up again) has moved from that neighborhood to &#8216;assist&#8217; us with ACAD Help?  Or maybe it&#8217;s his (also evil) twin brother?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4728</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 13:51:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4728</guid>
		<description>Brian, can you explain what you mean by &#039;relative information&#039;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brian, can you explain what you mean by &#8216;relative information&#8217;?</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Benton</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4727</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Benton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 11:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4727</guid>
		<description>My biggest complaint on the new help system has been the lack of relative information.  I would be willing to have it take a bit (just a bit) longer if i got quality results.  i still don&#039;t see that.  They are far better than before, but not there yet.  A search for the line command better bring the line command as a result.  BUT, it is improving and Autodesk acknowledges it&#039;s a problem. I am confident that the search issues in help will get resolved.  As for the speed, I hope that improves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My biggest complaint on the new help system has been the lack of relative information.  I would be willing to have it take a bit (just a bit) longer if i got quality results.  i still don&#8217;t see that.  They are far better than before, but not there yet.  A search for the line command better bring the line command as a result.  BUT, it is improving and Autodesk acknowledges it&#8217;s a problem. I am confident that the search issues in help will get resolved.  As for the speed, I hope that improves.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4726</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 09:21:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4726</guid>
		<description>Just tried it in IE8 and got 7 seconds F1 to landing the first time, 5 the next. On an example command (F1 hovering on MLEADER button), I got 9 the first time, 5 the next. That&#039;s on a different connection to that mentioned in my post, running at about 7 Mbps at the time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just tried it in IE8 and got 7 seconds F1 to landing the first time, 5 the next. On an example command (F1 hovering on MLEADER button), I got 9 the first time, 5 the next. That&#8217;s on a different connection to that mentioned in my post, running at about 7 Mbps at the time.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Capper</title>
		<link>http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/2010/05/12/autocad-2011-online-help-changes-a-curates-egg/#comment-4725</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Capper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 May 2010 09:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/?p=1011#comment-4725</guid>
		<description>Maybe it&#039;s an IE6 thing? It seems a lot more responsive than your timing here with IE 8 returning sub 2 second responses to most queries (ie cache cleared and not using local helo). One thing I have seen is the (annoying) Adobe Flash Script error dialog appearing on some pages as the AutoCAD Exchange widget loads. 

Perhaps Mr Jobs might like to comment :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe it&#8217;s an IE6 thing? It seems a lot more responsive than your timing here with IE 8 returning sub 2 second responses to most queries (ie cache cleared and not using local helo). One thing I have seen is the (annoying) Adobe Flash Script error dialog appearing on some pages as the AutoCAD Exchange widget loads. </p>
<p>Perhaps Mr Jobs might like to comment <img src='http://www.blog.cadnauseam.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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